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brokenglasseye

The Bellgrove Hotel.

Hi folks, I dunno that this is the right place to post this but here goes...

The Bellgrove Hotel.



Does anybody know anything about this place?
Who runs it?

There’s only a few mentions of it online.

Usually,
You’ll see people sitting in their own piss outside of the Bellgrove looking like they have about 2 hours to live.

It’s obviously a homeless hostel but have you actually seen the state of it?

Who gets up in the morning and goes to work in there?
Bet it’s not the council.

It’s been run down to hell since I always remember
Gareth1974

I used to live in the tower block that you see in the background.

The picture is a few years old as the white buildings in the mid-ground were demolished long ago.

I'm not sure who works there but I used to see some African guy - who was evidently a member of staff - going in and out of it.

Poor sod is probably a engineer or doctor in his own country and had to settle for a job there.

I don't know anything recent as I haven't ventured up that road in a long time since I 'escaped' from the Gallowgate earlier this year.
brokenglasseye

Gareth1974 wrote:
I used to live in the tower block that you see in the background.

The picture is a few years old as the white buildings in the mid-ground were demolished long ago.

I'm not sure who works there but I used to see some African guy - who was evidently a member of staff - going in and out of it.

Poor sod is probably a engineer or doctor in his own country and had to settle for a job there.

I don't know anything recent as I haven't ventured up that road in a long time since I 'escaped' from the Gallowgate earlier this year.


Cheers for chipping in!

I kow that I used an old photo there but only the background has changed since.
The hotel is still a total tip.
Gareth1974

Saw your website.

Looks like you're looking to create some surreal vision of Glasgow through your artwork and stories.

Think we have a common interest ... lol
cybers

Gareth no one escapes from the Gallowgate it gets into your very being  

As an aside it is still one of the last privately run hostels/models in Scotland and was subject to a Frontline Scotland Programme a wee while back detailing its failings but at the same time praising the fact it gave the homeless somewhere to sleep as the council closed more and more of its Models. Some wag has taken the time to update an old review of it that was kicking around since the internet was invented as the original review had Agnews Listed

Spoiler:

ONE OF THE BEST HOTELS I'VE EVER STAYED IN, VERY CENTRAL, RECREATION FACILITIES FIRST CLASS. CLOSE TO ALL THE LOCAL AMENITIES, BARLINNIE, HADDOWS AND THE GLASGOW ROYAL INFIRMARY

brokenglasseye

Gareth1974 wrote:
Saw your website.

Looks like you're looking to create some surreal vision of Glasgow through your artwork and stories.

Think we have a common interest ... lol


That's exactly what I'm trying to do Gareth!  
It takes a lot of work though and I don't think it's as 'Glasgow' as it could be.

But, it'll get there.

Drop by anytime my friend!
Gareth1974

I don't even think there's a Haddows there; just some wee grocers that sells Buckie and cheap cider.

There was a wee snack shop there too last time I was down with the proprietors optimistically placing some tables and chairs outside.

There's also a sports bar that has a sporadic opening schedule.

What you don't see of course is the new school with the excellent sports facilities just across the road.  

The whole area is being redeveloped as well and the cluster of shops and the Bellgrove are kind of holding it back.

May well be that it's one of the last hostels in the area but the council could inflate its coffers with the Council Tax and Rates from new houses and functioning businesses in place of these eyesores.
womble

cybers wrote:
Gareth no one escapes from the Gallowgate it gets into your very being  

As an aside it is still one of the last privately run hostels/models in Scotland and was subject to a Frontline Scotland Programme a wee while back detailing its failings but at the same time praising the fact it gave the homeless somewhere to sleep as the council closed more and more of its Models. Some wag has taken the time to update an old review of it that was kicking around since the internet was invented as the original review had Agnews Listed

Spoiler:

ONE OF THE BEST HOTELS I'VE EVER STAYED IN, VERY CENTRAL, RECREATION FACILITIES FIRST CLASS. CLOSE TO ALL THE LOCAL AMENITIES, BARLINNIE, HADDOWS AND THE GLASGOW ROYAL INFIRMARY



Cracker Cybers, and I think that one time or another most of UG has lived in the twin towers some good memories but mostly memories of junkies, thieves and stairs stinking of piss.
Jagz1876

cybers wrote:
Gareth no one escapes from the Gallowgate it gets into your very being  


Dare i say that it was the Gallowgate that had the luckier of escape's the day Gareth left.
cybers

There used to be a haddows right next door to the hotel and it was an Agnews before that ... Ali bought it over and turned it into a shop sometime in the early 80's as the Comic swap-shop was there the Wool shop and lest we forget ...

Johnny Ionta's With his brother Tommy  
No sure how many times i sat on the red leather plank or got choked to death by his talc puff but it has to rate in the thousands.
Gareth1974

I once stumbled across a pair sleeping on the stairs.  I don't know if they were homeless or waiting on their dealer coming back.

The stairs were so cold the past few winters that they had to cover the lower levels in gravel!

I can believe that this area would have been much nicer in the past, when it housed more families newly moved-in, but my tenure there coincided with them being used as a dumping ground for problem tenants and poor sods like me at the bottom of the housing list.

I actually blame myself because I worked in Parkhead Benefits Centre and used to see the tenants coming in after their release from prison.  I knew this because I had access to their files.

I was staying with my mother at the time after breaking-up with my wife and just thought I'd get a flat there quickly.

Still ... I love the flat I have now: so warm, decent neighbours (lots of little chinese girls in shorts   ), right next to the City Centre and upgraded fixtures courtesy of the GHA.

I feel sorry for the poor sods still up Whitevale/Bluevale with this winter coming up now.
brokenglasseye

Quote:
Cracker Cybers, and I think that one time or another most of UG has lived in the twin towers some good memories but mostly memories of junkies, thieves and stairs stinking of piss.


That's a good idea.
I'd be interested in reading stuff like that.
Gareth1974

lol ... I'm the authority on stories like that!
brokenglasseye

Gareth1974 wrote:
I once stumbled across a pair sleeping on the stairs.  I don't know if they were homeless or waiting on their dealer coming back.

The stairs were so cold the past few winters that they had to cover the lower levels in gravel!

I can believe that this area would have been much nicer in the past, when it housed more families newly moved-in, but my tenure there coincided with them being used as a dumping ground for problem tenants and poor sods like me at the bottom of the housing list.

I actually blame myself because I worked in Parkhead Benefits Centre and used to see the tenants coming in after their release from prison.  I knew this because I had access to their files.

I was staying with my mother at the time after breaking-up with my wife and just thought I'd get a flat there quickly.

Still ... I love the flat I have now: so warm, decent neighbours (lots of little chinese girls in shorts   ), right next to the City Centre and upgraded fixtures courtesy of the GHA.

I feel sorry for the poor sods still up Whitevale/Bluevale with this winter coming up now.


I'm glad you're all sorted now.
All the best!
cybers

Beano

cybers wrote:
There used to be a haddows right next door to the hotel and it was an Agnews before that ... Ali bought it over and turned it into a shop sometime in the early 80's as the Comic swap-shop was there the Wool shop and lest we forget ...

Johnny Ionta's With his brother Tommy  
No sure how many times i sat on the red leather plank or got choked to death by his talc puff but it has to rate in the thousands.
Cybers the wee man himself

cybers

Ah mind it well Ben ... Perr ah auld characters and well known in the area used to see him and his brother Tommy all the time walking up the road to their hoose in Whitehill St with the wee medicine style bag. Ah mind that shop had a woodbine fog though  
Beano

Aye cybers...ah recall sitting oan that very plank greetin ma eyes oot fur ma very first official haircut   looked a right kunt ah wiz 15    
cybers

   
Ah mind ma maw gon pure radio in there as for some reason wee Tommy heard Crew Cut instead of Short Back n Sides ... Every fecker at the scool thought i had nits or ringworm  

Funny as hell but i suppose most of the weans at that time got the old number two as a money saver just I never till that moment ... Looked a right khant cos 3 days later at Bonny Night i took my eyebrows clean aff with a bottle o turps and a lighter trying to light a rain soaked bonfire !!!
brokenglasseye

Hi folks, that's me just mastered Photobucket so here are two photos of The Bellgrove Hotel I took.
They're about 2 years old.



calamity

good ones there.. does anyone know what the hotel was used for early on when it was built..
Gareth1974

i think it may have been a cheap hotel for labourers/tradesmen who had to move around to find work.
calamity

seems strange though to build and art deco hotel in the Eastend of Glasgow and then use it for this...
Gareth1974

It looks similar in style to the building at the junction Elmbank St and Sauchiehall St - they're both Art Deco.  The Bellgrove of course is more run-down.

I think that's student accomodation now?

Some right nutters been in the Bellgrove.

I was walking past there one day and all I heard from one of the windows was,

' hey you ... aye you wi the bag yer a poof ... ye walk like a poof ... poof ... poof ...  poofy'

Somebody's methadone kicking in I think.

A lot of desperate people as well.

I used to work in the Lidl on Duke St and we would get some of them in.  One young guy used to come in with his hand shaking from the DTs, load up on cheap cider and lager, and order a taxi to the Bellgrove.

I would imagine there was some policy on alocohol in the accomodation and I don't know how he managed to smuggle it all in.
calamity

aye Ive seen them sitting outside with cans.. in fact Im sure Ive got a photo somewhere... oh aye some nutters right enough. I was thinking of asking permission to take photos but I dont think Ill bother.. found this.


http://www.britishlistedbuildings...7-607-gallowgate-bellgrove-hotel-
Gareth1974

'Historical photographs of the building in use as a hostel in the present dining hall show men relaxing in the lounge at tables and chairs or in easy chairs, and a `corner of the restaurant' where aproned waitresses stand beside ordered napery-laden tables. '

Could you believe it?

The Great Eastern is also now flats.
calamity

a review



http://www.glasgowonline.co.uk/reviews/1283/      Scotts cinema stood where the hotel is now.
hillmanimp

Gareth1974 wrote:


I used to work in the Lidl on Duke St and we would get some of them in.  One young guy used to come in with his hand shaking from the DTs, load up on cheap cider and lager, and order a taxi to the Bellgrove.

I would imagine there was some policy on alocohol in the accomodation and I don't know how he managed to smuggle it all in.


Probably didn't need to!  Just drank it all on the way there

Imp
calamity

http://www.glasgowonline.co.uk/reviews/10038/

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/scotland/975441.stm
cybers

http://www.britishlistedbuildings...7-607-gallowgate-bellgrove-hotel-


Sometimes its easy to laugh at the misfortunes of others whilst sitting safe and secure in the ivory tower. My brother in law ended up in the Broad Street establishment because his marriage broke down and he was too proud to ask his family for help he was one of the lucky ones who had a sense of direction and a purpose for his life. So many of those in the same situation end up there because of similar circumstances but get sucked down by the surrounding atmosphere. These places take all comers and are a somewhat safe haven compared to life on the streets and a pretty dire existence it is too.
My best mates ma and sisters worked at the Great Eastern in the 70-80's and during school holidays we were always around the hotel and the conditions even then were bloody horrendous.
Sydney Rosewater

I delivered it's bundle of mail this morning.
Stuball

Sydney Rosewater wrote:
I delivered it's bundle of mail this morning.


Take a wee camera in next time  
calamity

good idea.....


Gareth1974

Thre's some guy I always used to see walking from it in the morning.  

He had a guitar with just 4 strings on it and always seemed to be heading down towards the Gallowgate.
Sydney Rosewater

Gareth1974 wrote:
Thre's some guy I always used to see walking from it in the morning.  

He had a guitar with just 4 strings on it and always seemed to be heading down towards the Gallowgate.


He still is a permanent feature of the gallowgate. Guitar usually slung over is back.
hillmanimp

cybers wrote:
http://www.britishlistedbuildings...7-607-gallowgate-bellgrove-hotel-


Sometimes its easy to laugh at the misfortunes of others whilst sitting safe and secure in the ivory tower. My brother in law ended up in the Broad Street establishment because his marriage broke down and he was too proud to ask his family for help he was one of the lucky ones who had a sense of direction and a purpose for his life. So many of those in the same situation end up there because of similar circumstances but get sucked down by the surrounding atmosphere. These places take all comers and are a somewhat safe haven compared to life on the streets and a pretty dire existence it is too.
My best mates ma and sisters worked at the Great Eastern in the 70-80's and during school holidays we were always around the hotel and the conditions even then were bloody horrendous.


cybers

Although I made a bit of a joke, I wasn't laughing at the misfortunes of others.  I apologise if that's the way it came across.

I remember a quote from a few years back where someone said that most of us are just 3 paychecks from destitution.  I saw a programme (world's strictest parents's) earlier this year, where a young British man, who was in America, was taken to a soup kitchen.  One of the chaps he spoke to told him that he used to be in good well-paid job and that he thought that homeless people were lazy and not prepared to help themselves.  Then he was made redundant!  He couldn't get another job, and after a relatively short time found he was homeless and in the same position as the people he had previously scorned.  Sobering indeed.

Imp
Gareth1974

Read George Orwell's 'Down and Out In Paris and London' and that challenges misconceptions of destitution.

Then again go watch Laurel and Hardy or Charlie Chaplin: misery loves company and most comedy is based on other's misfortune.

Same works from the same era.
cybers

hillmanimp wrote:
cybers wrote:
http://www.britishlistedbuildings...7-607-gallowgate-bellgrove-hotel-


Sometimes its easy to laugh at the misfortunes of others whilst sitting safe and secure in the ivory tower. My brother in law ended up in the Broad Street establishment because his marriage broke down and he was too proud to ask his family for help he was one of the lucky ones who had a sense of direction and a purpose for his life. So many of those in the same situation end up there because of similar circumstances but get sucked down by the surrounding atmosphere. These places take all comers and are a somewhat safe haven compared to life on the streets and a pretty dire existence it is too.
My best mates ma and sisters worked at the Great Eastern in the 70-80's and during school holidays we were always around the hotel and the conditions even then were bloody horrendous.


cybers

Although I made a bit of a joke, I wasn't laughing at the misfortunes of others.  I apologise if that's the way it came across.

I remember a quote from a few years back where someone said that most of us are just 3 paychecks from destitution.  I saw a programme (world's strictest parents's) earlier this year, where a young British man, who was in America, was taken to a soup kitchen.  One of the chaps he spoke to told him that he used to be in good well-paid job and that he thought that homeless people were lazy and not prepared to help themselves.  Then he was made redundant!  He couldn't get another job, and after a relatively short time found he was homeless and in the same position as the people he had previously scorned.  Sobering indeed.

Imp


It was not you !
I think i passed comment on here a long time back about a wee court order i had to make good on, something i had done in a previous time... My mate also had the same order in place and he chose a career path out of helping those less fortunate than himself and he still does a sterling job with the homeless and those in the sex industry In and around Glasgow and can often be see wandering around just giving them someone to talk to. Still talk to loads of characters myself and it just yanks my chain how easy these people fall into the lifestyle for various reasons. What i have noticed is the amount of people who are living in destitution with an addiction that is actually a mask for an underlying mental health issue but they have been forgotten and neglected by the system and left by the wayside. Try looking beyond the eccentric guy who needs to touch every lampost on his way down the Gallowgate, or the madman who likes to shout at poofs with manbags they are all people and perhaps if you take some time to listen you will find out there actually all there and a wee bit mer...

In fact some of these alkies junkies and mental cases can spot a real social problem faster than most as they have to live that life daily.
Gareth1974

Was actually a sports bag I had cybers ... something simmering there?

There's actually a few active campaigns to close that place down because of the anti-social behaviour from the tenants and the fact that the neds are hanging around outside looking to cause trouble with the tenants and picking on anyone else who passes by.

Since the area was developed a lot of young women who have bought the flats just up the road are being harassed by the tenants; my girlfriend had that experience a few times along with her friends.

I don't need a lecture on homelesness as my own mother was homeless in london when she was 16 after being dumped out of the home she was brought up in.  She now has a whole catalogue of health problems due to her living rough on the streets for that short period.

I even had a good family friend die in the Great Eastern after being thrown out by his wife.

I'm sure you'll use what details I have posted here to use against me in any future postings - as you have done before with other details I have disclosed about myself.  I on the other hand won't reduce myself to your petty and snide level by making any assumptions about your brother.

The nature of this posting is because you have deliberately referred to me in your reply even though I haven't even targeted you directly.

Once again you seem to think you can dictate what others post here.

I'm sure this thread will now be locked so I won't bother playing ping-pong with you here.
calamity

When our tenements were being demolished in Fordneuk st/Broad st , a Mens Home was being bult facing us, in the late 60s... I remember my wee ma complaining that they couldnt build enough new houses so that we could stay in Brigton but could build one of these... and it always makes me laugh when they build these places, they always seem to be in poor areas dont they.. never in posh ones..  This place turned into a right nightmare.. and I dont think you could have gave away a new house in the area at the time...
Gareth1974

It's probably because there wouldn't be much call for such a facility in a so-called 'posh area' calamity.

Also depends what you define as a 'posh area' - Glasgow has rows of bought houses alongside housing schemes because it's such a small city.  the people who own these homes aren't usually posh but just people who've bought their own homes.  This number of people have been steadily increasing in the previous decades.

These establishments would also drive down the price of their homes, and in turn their Council Tax band, which would lead to a loss of revenue for the councils.  That opens the debate on the relative unfairness of the replacement for the Council Tax - the proposed Local Income Tax - where people who would pay more charges to local authorities are actually the ones who use these services less.
cybers

Gareth1974 wrote:
Was actually a sports bag I had cybers ... something simmering there?

There's actually a few active campaigns to close that place down because of the anti-social behaviour from the tenants and the fact that the neds are hanging around outside looking to cause trouble with the tenants and picking on anyone else who passes by.

Since the area was developed a lot of young women who have bought the flats just up the road are being harassed by the tenants; my girlfriend had that experience a few times along with her friends.

I don't need a lecture on homelesness as my own mother was homeless in london when she was 16 after being dumped out of the home she was brought up in.  She now has a whole catalogue of health problems due to her living rough on the streets for that short period.

I even had a good family friend die in the Great Eastern after being thrown out by his wife.

I'm sure you'll use what details I have posted here to use against me in any future postings - as you have done before with other details I have disclosed about myself.  I on the other hand won't reduce myself to your petty and snide level by making any assumptions about your brother.

The nature of this posting is because you have deliberately referred to me in your reply even though I haven't even targeted you directly.

Once again you seem to think you can dictate what others post here.

I'm sure this thread will now be locked so I won't bother playing ping-pong with you here.


First of i merely quoted what "YOU" said "THEY" said about you and your bag and the fact "THEY" referred to you as a poof purely in the contextual but hey ho your obviously a little insecure carry on i am not willing to bite like i said i offered you the chance to put it straight a while back i did it very openly. From a strictly personal point of view i have you firmly pidgeon holed in the "depressing bastard section" But do not post stuff your claiming as factual then get all arsey when we make a relevant post and make reference to what you said.
You seem to think I am on your case, out to get you you fail miserably to stay on topic and then try to refer to books and films to poke comedy at the homeless. There is no need to lock the thread just call the cops your good at that one if you feel threatened or intimidated. Till then Like i stated previously in relevance to the thread, The addictions most of these guy's have is self medication for underlying mental health issues ... Do not read half a paragraph before replying and lighten the hell up its not all about you. You as a so called Ex-housing officer should know the issues these people have but then seeing as your no longer a housing officer maybe its ok. Opps sorry did i just post something you might have posted as factual again ....

Might be as well locking the thread after all its not a discussion if we cannot refer back to previous posts now is it ?

P.S if you would have let me finish and i have to make reference to something else you said but will try not to quote you directly.
The guy with the guitar is Brian Dunlop. A Very Talented Musician who suffers from schizophrenia no one takes the piss out of Seaside Steve for having a 2 string guitar but then maybe Brian is not famous enough for narrow minded people.
Gareth1974

I wasn't a Housing Officer by the way!

I don't need a lecture on schizophrenia either as I lived for 7 years with a girl who suffered from it.  I even worked voluntary in the kitchen of a drop-in centre that catered for people with mental health problems.  I done this for no pay just to get experience to pull myself out the depths of unemployment and to the dizzy heights of dishwasher who could pay his own rent.  

I actually got a few private messages from people as well after the Toryglen thread got locked ... they all stated they didn't find my comments depressing ... once again you've completely ignored the majority of the other postings I've made.  You'll see that the Toryglen thread has been unlocked now because of requests made by other users.

Why don't yo just stick to the IDS thread and keep ranting about how everything is the fault of some politician who hasn't held office for 20 years ... oh wait ... that makes things 'wrong and bad' ... NEGATIVITY ALERT!!

You really are wrapped up in your own wee world aren't you?

Bottom line - quote was directed at me Cybers ... you wanted a reaction so you got it ... bye!
cybers

Your too funny such a lot in such a short life.... Keep painting the city as some dark place from a book. The Toryglen thread was unlocked you were told by mods to lighten up even after calling a Glasgow Black Hack driver a liar you carried on in your own depressing little way. Your a depressing little guy who seems to have done too much of everything in his short life and a whole lot of nothing except get slapped around lots.

What is it ? Daddy Issues ? Is it complicated ... did you make the wee woman at the Samaritans suicidal ?

Lighten up I merely posted something relevant to the thread and you took umbrage to it If you need a babysitter to hold your hand posting to forums then perhaps the internet is not for you. I never posted what i did to get a rise from you that would be too damn easy If you cant deal with the facts keep posting away with your sh!te after all people are already getting bored with it and not just me...

As for your little comment about the IDS thread.... You just stuck yourself out there as a target .... Who else made the Original reference to The former Prime Minister oops was it admin was i merely making comment ON topic have i merely made over 6000 of those ...

"SHUT UP FANNY BAWS AND PULL UP YIR MANKINI"
Gareth1974

Yer a funny wee man cybers.

I wonder who's 'getting bored with me' - your imaginary friends?  Funny because nobody other than you has had any issues with any of my postings and the few private messages were messages of support.

I post a few paragraphs (word for word a small minority of what i've posted) about the darker side of life and i get targeted by cybers the internet troll.

wibble wibble yah fruitcake!

Think you need to address these issues you have about attacking people's masculinity and/or sexuality.

Issues?  Wee blue pill no working for you anymore?
cybers

Gareth1974 wrote:
Yer a funny wee man cybers.

I wonder who's 'getting bored with me' - your imaginary friends?  Funny because nobody other than you has had any issues with any of my postings and the few private messages were messages of support.

I post a few paragraphs (word for word a small minority of what i've posted) about the darker side of life and i get targeted by cybers the internet troll.

wibble wibble yah fruitcake!

Think you need to address these issues you have about attacking people's masculinity and/or sexuality.

Issues?  Wee blue pill no working for you anymore?


Listen Blackadder i have no issues with you .... Do you wish to call the police again ... Yes i do have issues with you i think personally your a twat like i said your involved with your own self importance carry on kid ... I gave you the option to prove your black belt martial arts skills you posted as fact you declined you were in the navy do you have a problem with sexuality ? You were the very person who said they called you a poof .... Where did i call you a poof or even refer to your sexuality. Perhaps those who sent you the messages of support would like to make their postings known .... Perhaps the larger number who get riled by the posting of sh!te and a Glasgow not one of them recognises you make will also make their feeling known openly.

Dont post stuff as fact if no ones allowed to make reference to it clownshoes .... As for reference to my brother .... Brother In Law stupid ... it was what i posted merely the facts. feel free to quote me but at least do it accurately instead of looking like a cnut ! I wont take umbrage or offence if you decide to find something i may have posted that is of relevance to you and your post...

Now perhaps you could remain on topic or is there another burning issue you have after all for 25 year married to the same woman no need for little blue pills. Drive as a job for a well known logistic company for 2 years before that another company for 15. Spent time in Asia anything you feel you need to know feel free to ask any blanks i can fill in for you just ask but do it in a P.M as your inability to stay on topic is matched by your inability to find a permanent address without attracting trouble.
Gareth1974

poke ... poke ... prod ... prod

Let's see your response to this ... let's see what details about me that you obsessively stored away and will drag out in your comeback.

I reported you the moderator first time but I won't bother this time because one of them will stumble upon this and lock it I'm sure.

Let's see how long people get annoyed with you when all their threads get locked because of your maniacal rants.

poke ... poke ... prod ... prod
cybers

I have no response ... i never had a response ...
You better call Taggart though ... Your a lying wee guy plain and simple sadly lacking something who knows what ....

But when you post depressing sh!te I will be sure to let you know !

Mods i am sorry and i did state previously i would only post factual responses to his posts which if you look is all I did but alas i am wrong for stating the obvious.
Gareth1974

poke .... poke ... prod ... prod

sad wee man!

poke ... poke ... prod ... prod
hillmanimp

Gareth1974 wrote:
Read George Orwell's 'Down and Out In Paris and London' and that challenges misconceptions of destitution.

Then again go watch Laurel and Hardy or Charlie Chaplin: misery loves company and most comedy is based on other's misfortune.

Same works from the same era.


Gareth

I read Orwell's book quite a few years back.  Quite an eye-opener.  It's sitting on the shelf, must re-read it.

I can also recommend his "Homage to Catalonia".  Particularly interesting was his description of certain incidents, and what he found was written in the newspapers afterwards about those incidents.   "History written by the victors!"

Imp
cybers

Yawn really is this as good as your lying wee life gets ? Still nothing of relevance to add to the thread .... Come on a seasoned liar like yirsel must have a great tale of woe hardship and doom and gloom.

As a wee asides and strictly in keeping with the topic I lived in a tenement across the road from here in Soho St. A dire place that had seen many better days but the strange thing is it's long gone destined to a forgotten era when the toilet was outside the Firestation was at the bottom of the road and Tommy Burns played football in the street. I am sure Beano lived there too but will no doubt need to wait on the topic getting locked cleaned and reopened before that can be confirmed.
I remember the buildings as Black with soot and have yet to come across a photo ofof the actual street in question but i mind we got moved oot to a nice shiny dwelling in Castlemilk at number 11 Arnprior Road...
My maw loved the new house but hated the fact we were the only ones from the family there as a wean i thought it was magical open spaces to play and a huge long grassed field to play soldiers in at the back.

It was not to last though as we were soon on the swapsy and into Barrowfield it was... That was even better .... Railway embankments scrap yards barrel works all the things for a real adventure.
Gareth1974

Yeah Imp I've read Homage to Catalonia ... Orwell is my favourite author because he writes from a basis of reality and not dogma.  Orwell had a strong aversion to 'eccentrics' as he labelled them: vegetarians, nudists and beurgois people who aspired to be working class.  He believed them to be the greatest danger to Socialism.  He never abandoned his middle-class roots and acknowledged that even with disparities in wealth removed such distinction between classes would still exist to some extent.

He also disliked the anti-education culture of some of the working classes who believed that they could simply exist off the same industry in perpetuity.

His work was attacked by the left-wing who wanted propoganda and not what they labelled 'negativity.'  Seems many people can't accept the good with the bad.  For many years the second section of The Road to Wigan Pier remained unpublished because of the above comments I paraphrased.

I remember Homage to Catalonia where he had serious problems procuring weapons, especially pistols that he needed in the close confines of the trench warfare, and when he got to Madrid he found the Communist Commissars all walking about with clean uniforms and sporting shiny pistols.

To think that the Bellgrove would have stood at the same time Orwell wrote 'Down and Out'  ... well that book was the 1920's wasn't it?  I think it's fair to say that it is still contemporary.

I'm even inclined to believe that both Orwell and Adolf Hitler may have lain in a doss house not that far from each other in Europe on the same nights.

Two men from the same era who took different paths.

Autobiography/biography can sometimes be history in it's purest form.
Gareth1974

Sorry I haven't replied to your post on the Toryglen thread yet Imp.  I'll respond to it soon.

I'll need to head up there soon as the shops are being brought down and i was taking notes about the shops, who owned them and what they were used for etc.

You found out any more info about the story of those two boys?  I got another message from another user who believes he lived in either the site of the incident or the home where one of them came from.
cybers

In an age of universal deceit, telling the truth is a revolutionary act.

Was also attributed to Orwell ... I find it fits rather well here.
Jagz1876

Gareth1974 wrote:


I'm sure this thread will now be locked so I won't bother playing ping-pong with you here.

If only that were true
Gareth1974

Kind of went back on my word there didn't I?
cybers

Ironically the very taxi driver you called a liar..
calamity

slight change in direction but does anyone remember Roses Home off the London road.. dont remember the wee street it was in, not far past Templetons on the other side of the road..
Beano

cybers wrote:

I lived in a tenement across the road from here in Soho St. A dire place that had seen many better days but the strange thing is it's long gone destined to a forgotten era when the toilet was outside the Firestation was at the bottom of the road and Tommy Burns played football in the street. I am sure Beano lived there too



Aye mate ah remember it well, ma best mate (Jim Young) lived in the close near the Firestation. There used tae be a wee comic shoap near the Gallowgate end wur ye kin buy a gless o'ginger fur 3d an every kid drank oot of the same unwashed glass tumbler   (ah think that basturd wiz responsible) fur the outbreak of cauld sores in the Gallowgate   In the 60s as I recall the Belgrove Hotel at that time never had any drunks hanging about outside.
calamity

wizne the dirty tumblers ataw and fine well ye know.....   aye there was a wee book shop there , mind it well, the fire station wae the wee swingpark facing it.. I lived further down in Fordneuk st.
Beano

calamity wrote:
wizne the dirty tumblers ataw and fine well ye know.....   aye there was a wee book shop there , mind it well, the fire station wae the wee swingpark facing it.. I lived further down in Fordneuk st.
 ah wull get ye back fur that wummin, ah went tae Campbellfield then Annfield primary school an the lollipop man stood at the Bellgrove Hotel as I said never recall any drunks late 50s or 60s Calamity kin you remember the stables in Comelypark st Iv'e been trying tae fined a photae.
cybers

Thing is Ben even in the 80's and 90's I have no real recollection of anyone hanging around outside the Bellgrove just comings and goings and the eternal phack phack of the saloon style swing doors opening and closing. I do mind a shooting there probably about 1985 or so and the polis gone pure radio rental cos us weans were  all sitting on the embankment at Crownpoint Sports watching. As for the wee swap shop that used to be there... Happy days indeed used to go there with my Grandad till he swapped his books for another read and i thought it wiz magic as i got to change the well worn commando's for another one it was the first place i remember tasting blue slush puppy, As i got older this changes to the True Crime magazines where we used to imagine the gangsters and their molls they referred to and images of crime scenes far away in America.

A wee interesting report on the Hostel Closure programme conducted by The University of York and The Centre For Housing Policy
PDF DOCUMENT
Beano

cybers wrote:
Thing is Ben even in the 80's and 90's I have no real recollection of anyone hanging around outside the Bellgrove just comings and goings and the eternal phack phack of the saloon style swing doors opening and closing. I do mind a shooting there probably about 1985 or so and the polis gone pure radio rental cos us weans were  all sitting on the embankment at Crownpoint Sports watching. As for the wee swap shop that used to be there... Happy days indeed used to go there with my Grandad till he swapped his books for another read and i thought it wiz magic as i got to change the well worn commando's for another one it was the first place i remember tasting blue slush puppy, As i got older this changes to the True Crime magazines where we used to imagine the gangsters and their molls they referred to and images of crime scenes far away in America.

A wee interesting report on the Hostel Closure programme conducted by The University of York and The Centre For Housing Policy
PDF DOCUMENT
cybers..."The Profile of Ex-Residents and Their Reasons for Homelessness" just about covers who ended up in the hostels and I think many just became institutionalised with the daily drudgery of a life with no hope.
cybers

Ben that is it to a tee. No one really understands how quickly you become lost in the depths of despair and the Hostel life becomes a surrogate for normal living. Mental health issues are more prevalent mainly because these poor bastards were dumped out of another system and labelled "Care In The Community" quickly to find the community did not care. The youngers guys never knew institutional mental care and for the large part have been left to get on with it unless they are lucky enough to have a social worker or case worker who is on the ball and not frightened to ruffle a few feathers. In all honesty I would be surprised if the Belgrove is not closed or just gone before the Starlight Express that is the Commonwealth Games rolls into town. It will be classed as some no doubt as a cynical view but to other seasoned members I am sure they have already thought the same thing.

Who wants a Hotel full of tramps and vagrants messing up the shiny shiny showpiece but the problem will only be decanted it wont go away.

As a wee side note can you imagine a tourist getting a wee bit confused and making a reservation by telephone for the games to stay in that fine establishment...

Sorry sir we only accept cash or girocheque.
Jagz1876

cybers wrote:


As a wee side note can you imagine a tourist getting a wee bit confused and making a reservation by telephone for the games to stay in that fine establishment...

Sorry sir we only accept cash or girocheque.

Funny you should mention that, Cybers. I remember when the well known Glasgow historian Jack House, had a weekly column in the Evening Times, and one week he recalled that being unable to stay at their usual hotel in the city, The Joe Loss Orchestra turned up at the Great Eastern hotel only to beat a hasty retreat when confronted by a foyer full of dossers. The thought of it still makes me chuckle  
calamity

surely though in those days it was long distance lorry drivers.. still if it was Joe Loss I can imagine his face...
cybers

Just really goes to show though
"wha's like us ?"

Gareth1974

Personally don't see the difference between containing them in hostels or containing them in institutions.

When i worked in a mental health drop-in I used to listen to the stories of the people with mental health problems and for them being locked-up in in a hospital wasn't much better than their current predicament.  In fact some of them believed that being locked-up meant they were subjected to a harsh regime; like prisoners who had committed no crime   A lot of their stories seemed to revolve around ways of temporarily escaping from the wards to go spend a few hours in the pub just so they could feel like human beings again.

Medication and alcohol not a good mix but I think most of them had no faith in their medication anyway.

I think there's an assumption here that all the residents of these places have a mental health issue that requires residential treatment for prolonged periods of time when that simply just isn't the case.
calamity

I remember as a wee lassie in some church club bein taken at Xmas to sing for women in a home along at the Barras. I dont remember the name of the place or why these women were in there staying. they seemed to me to be older women , and it was still there in the 60s as I remember them outside the door of the home when we were queuing for the Barrowland..Ive just had a read about this place for women.. and their circumstances.

http://www.heraldscotland.com/the-last-women-of-inglefield-1.828691
Gareth1974

Quote:
Amy has been working as a prostitute since she was 18 to fund her heroin and alcohol addiction.

"I was sexually abused but that's not why I took heroin. I took it because I tried it six or seven times and thought I liked it and kept doing it. I hear lassies using the fact they were raped as an excuse but you do things because you like doing them. If you really wanted to go out and drink you'd do it, no matter what anyone else said, and you wouldn't be doing it just because of something that happened to you as a kid."


Kind of sums it all up really.

So many excuses for heroin: crime, abuse, depression, Reagan/Thatcher/Blair and all the rest.

Every so often you see someone like come along and be plain honest about it.

I doubt heroin was an issue in the 60's.  Read Janey Godley's book 'Handstands in the Dark', set near the Calton and East End - back in the 60's the soma of choice was alcohol and/or Valium.
Beano

Gareth1974 wrote:
Quote:
Amy has been working as a prostitute since she was 18 to fund her heroin and alcohol addiction.

"I was sexually abused but that's not why I took heroin. I took it because I tried it six or seven times and thought I liked it and kept doing it. I hear lassies using the fact they were raped as an excuse but you do things because you like doing them. If you really wanted to go out and drink you'd do it, no matter what anyone else said, and you wouldn't be doing it just because of something that happened to you as a kid."


Kind of sums it all up really.

So many excuses for heroin: crime, abuse, depression, Reagan/Thatcher/Blair and all the rest.

Every so often you see someone like come along and be plain honest about it.

I doubt heroin was an issue in the 60's.  Read Janey Godley's book 'Handstands in the Dark', set near the Calton and East End - back in the 60's the soma of choice was alcohol and/or Valium.
"I was sexually abused but that's not why I took heroin" well it could be that abuse left a deep emotional scar and Amy did'nt want to admit this and bravado leads too that statement. You seem to gloss over the child abuse just to score some points about politicians, we failed Amy at the time when she was most vulnerable and needed our help. Amy was a  prostitute by the time she was 18yrs not surprising considering her life. Amy's life of abuse has continued into adult life through a network of pimps, drug pushers and fuckin dirty old men, do you think for one moment that was her choice. As for the  politicians they dictate where money is spent or cut and our society reflects their decisions.
Gareth1974

Her words Beano.

Just begs the question about what degree of intervention the State should provide?  

What form should this intervention take?  How much are we prepared to pay?  Who should pay it?  do you think all these people will voluntarily submit to this intervention and accept it?

Was there a 'Golden Age' of institutional care?  Remember they used to lock up girls just for having children out of wedlock.  My mother had a breakdown and she was in Leverendale with an elderly woman who had been put there aged 15 for becoming pregnant.

Also raises the issue of free-will.  

As for 'scoring points against politicians' well that goes on all the time with whatever faction using these people as pawns for their own argument.
calamity

still cant find anything about Roses Home for men off London road or the womems hostel at the Barras. but got this from Abercromby street ..

http://www.theglasgowstory.com/image.php?inum=TGSG00015

just reading this from Shelter site. and why people end up homeless

relationship breakdown: 41 per cent
being asked to leave the family home: 28 per cent
drug and alcohol problems: 31 per cent and 28 per cent respectively
leaving prison: 25 per cent
mental health problems: 19 per cent
other: for example, eviction, problems with benefits payments.
and other problems.
http://england.shelter.org.uk/cam...lessness/What_causes_homelessness
cybers

Gareth1974 wrote:
Personally don't see the difference between containing them in hostels or containing them in institutions.

When i worked in a mental health drop-in I used to listen to the stories of the people with mental health problems and for them being locked-up in in a hospital wasn't much better than their current predicament.  In fact some of them believed that being locked-up meant they were subjected to a harsh regime; like prisoners who had committed no crime   A lot of their stories seemed to revolve around ways of temporarily escaping from the wards to go spend a few hours in the pub just so they could feel like human beings again.

Medication and alcohol not a good mix but I think most of them had no faith in their medication anyway.

I think there's an assumption here that all the residents of these places have a mental health issue that requires residential treatment for prolonged periods of time when that simply just isn't the case.


Not all the residents have mental health issues and it was never implied some gain them in these places and if you really listened to the folk who have been institutionalised like you claim you have they will tell you they miss the care, they miss the fact someone at least spoke to them on a daily basis in hospital. Some of these people can go weeks without the interaction of another single human some of them like it that way it's a very sad lonely predicament to be in Some through no fault of their own others dumped there by an unforgiving society.

Calamity was there not a Hostel in Montieth Row is that the one or was that just a big knocking shop ? Too young to remember but i kinda mind something down there as well as the tales of hard earned spent in area of Montieth Row.... Ooops and erm the question was not meant the way it sounds

calamity

there is a place just now down Monteith Row. but a far cry from Bellgrove. this looks lovely and clean.. ah dont know about the one years ago.. I didnt know about it then...cant find anything on Roses Home anywhere. what was that wee street it was in.. not far past where the new Thenew building is...
cybers

The place i am talking about was either that very one on the corner of Montieth Place or next door .... The one your looking for are you sure it was called Roses ? Do you have a link to its possible location via google maps ? been googling it for a bit and like you it returns nothing.

Did stumble upon this wee link that refers to one that caught fire and burned down in Abercromby Street but no mention anywhere of Roses

http://discuss.glasgowguide.co.uk...-Model-Lodging-Houses-t13104.html
calamity

Im going to contact the Mitchell and ask them for details. but aye it was definitely Roses Home in a dead end street near Rhoda s dress shop. long gone now.. and before Peter Rossis cafe on the other side of the road..
calamity

calamity wrote:
Im going to contact the Mitchell and ask them for details. but aye it was definitely Roses Home in a dead end street near Rhoda s dress shop. long gone now.. and before Peter Rossis cafe on the other side of the road..
 found it ... Craignestock street..

http://www.rootschat.com/forum/in.../topic,186042/prev_next,next.html Re: Craignestock Street ??
« Reply #4 on: Friday 25 August 06 23:01 BST (UK) »
Yes, my 1935 Post Office Street Directory shows the entry for 4 Craignestock Street to be 'Rose's Homes Ltd', and the Trades Directory lists Wm. Rose at 4 Craignestock Street under the entries for 'Lodgings'.   They also appear to have had at least three other lodgings in the City.

David.
cybers

Was it a childrens home rather than workin mans flop hoose... Was actually beginning to wonder if it was a bastardised version of Rossi's you mentioned earlier. Good bit of 'tec work there Mrs Gumshoe
calamity

  got help on Glesga pals , a woman knew the street name and I looked it up ... naw it was men in the 50s who lived there Cybers.
calamity

calamity wrote:
  got help on Glesga pals , a woman knew the street name and I looked it up ... naw it was men in the 50s who lived there Cybers.
The FEDS bulding was Roses Home.
http://www.glesga.ukpals.com/streets/londonrd-craignestockst.htm
yokerbrian

cybers wrote:
Was it a childrens home rather than workin mans flop hoose... Was actually beginning to wonder if it was a bastardised version of Rossi's you mentioned earlier. Good bit of 'tec work there Mrs Gumshoe


It's interesting that you think it might have been a childrens home, whenever I was being a naughty nipper in the mid 70's my dad would threaten to send me to Rose's home, we lived in Partick at the time, but if we were out by Victoria Park he would point to the two large red sandstone buildings on Westland Drive, and tell me that was where I'd end up if I didn't behave - ROSE'S HOME

Later on in life I asked him what Rose's home was and he said he had simply used the same threat that my grandfather had used on him, and he had thought it was just a made up tale.

But my grandfather was born in Calton in 1910 and lived there until he was 18, so he would have been familiar with Rose's Home for Working men from growing up there

Coincidently my sister uses the same "threat" whenever my niece is playing up.
Stuball

*sigh*

Gareth, man up and stop taking things so personally
cybers

10pm on my todd no sign of the fabled neds just the comings and goings of the residents... Real Glasgow - The Bellgrove Hotel


Bellgrove Hotel by David C Laurie, on Flickr
Jagz1876

So no one saw you manbag then.
Beano

Cybers.... Super-dooper shot mate        
Doorstop

POW!!!

And ne'ery a staggering Burberry clad tracksuit warrior in sight.

Funny that.

Excellent shot mate ..  
calamity

fantastic Ive never seen a night time shot of the hotel. oh the one for women at the Barras was Moncur st..run by the Glasgow Corporation..
cybers

Strange thing is DS i was actually talking to my nephew about troubles in the area and to be honest what he was describing and what i related back its actually quieter there now than when i was a kid .... One can only wonder at the socially inept victim who purported these stories of Neds and Jakes causing havoc and whether the fact they describe Cher videos as real life has some bearing on the outcome of their very being....

If Ah could Turn Back Time ..... Lets sit a scantilly clad fake sailor on a gun ...

Who wants to see the video of big Cher sitting astride a Bofors 40/60 I know i do !!!
sputnik

mibbees theres a bit more policing in the area due to the forthcoming common wolf games.
cybers

Maybe there is a cut in policing due to the lack of housing as the clearances set in ... Perhaps I may be cynical but when your family lives in the area and has done forever and you visit on a regular basis its easy to be cynical ... If there is raised policing in the area it was not apparent last night the place was the same as it always looks lately, like a scene from 28 days later day and  night. This was not some creep along in the dead of night photo this was one of a series of 20 or so shots all averaging 30 second exposures I was not wearing camoflague gear or hiding in the shadows and no one who passed even made the remotest of comments to me. There used to be some bustle in the area its now dead and souless and no doubt the fire will claim the building before the games arrive.
calamity

wiznae yesterday in Dalmarnock road ..

http://news.stv.tv/scotland/west-...violent-attack-in-glasgow-street/
cybers

16:20 in the afternoon usually means purpose though could just be a spill over that went to far. But as a woman wandering round taking photos in some mad places do you live in constant fear and dread ? Or like the rest of us yi just get on with living, And lets face it lady you have been in some mad places taking photos  
calamity

ah wiznae ther honest, but wiz tempted  
bAzTNM

Still an absolutely horrendous place.

My Uncle lives next door to an ex-Bellgrove Hotel resident. A total nightmare by all accounts.

Also, a religious organisation is going about buying houses for people in the Bellgrove Hotel. Why would they do that? They are not even vetting them. Just buying houses and flinging people into them. East End residents need to watch that sh!t. What are they up to?
cybers

Care to name the religious Organisation  

Never heard this before now so it has me curious.
bAzTNM

Don't honestly know. They seem to have bought a load in the Calton.
Moderator Edit

Please be aware this forum is Non-Sectarian and one should have all
the facts before posting any such claims ...Beano

bAzTNM

From asking about, it seems to be the Jehovas Witnesses who seem to have staked out the Calton as a good hunting ground recently. Always gets groups at my door.
Fat Cat

Bellgrove "Hotel"

Heard this is getting the heave ho.   Anyone got any info?
cybers

It was rumoured to have received a grant from Lottery for restoration but this was unconfirmed and when i made enquiries there was a wall of silence so there may well be some truth in the removal as it would be a blight to the glitter games.

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